Wednesday, October 5, 2011

Really Stupid Liars

Ross Douthat:
Now one can draw two possible conclusions from these difficulties. One possibility is that the authors and compilers of Genesis weren’t just liars; they were really stupid liars, who didn’t bother doing the basic work required to make their fabrication remotely plausible or coherent. The other possibility is that Genesis was never intended to be read as a literal blow-by-blow history of the human race’s first few months, and that its account of how sin entered the world partakes of allegorical and symbolic elements — like many other stories in the Bible, from the Book of Job to the Book of Revelation — to make a  theological and moral point.

FLG is always shocked by the number of people who don't know an allegorical interpretation goes back to at least Augustine. Despite what a lot of the Richard Dawkins' of the world would like to believe, religious believers aren't a bunch of morons. They have brains and have thought about this stuff for a couple of millennia.


Jacob T. Levy said...

Shorter Douthat, and maybe shorter FLG: "It's all atheists' fault that in the US evangelical fundamentalism is both larger and more active in the culture wars than Catholicism."

The Ancient said...

There are all sorts of Catholics, even here in the U.S.

In rural Virginia, for example, would a small child who scoffed at the story of Noah and the Ark be slapped down in Sunday morning CCD? Probably more often than not.

FLG said...


That's not so much my point. I just think that a lot of the militant Atheists seem to lump believers into this undifferentiated category with evangelical fundamentalism.

Jacob T. Levy said...

It would help if there were Catholics openly an prominently involved in , say, the fights against creationism in schools.

The Ancient said...

Everyone forgets that the Catholic Church is now generally supportive of science in a way it wasn't -- ever -- as late as WW2.

As John Paul II was fond of saying, "truth cannot contradict truth."

But you're not going to see Catholics demonstrating in an organized way against creationism in schools because they wouldn't want to imperil the alliances they've made with Protestant evangelicals on the issue of abortion.

Anonymous said...

"It's all atheists' fault that in the US evangelical fundamentalism is both larger and more active in the culture wars than Catholicism."

Uhm, most respectfully, this is bunk.

Mrs. P

Anonymous said...

Top this Evangelicals and Fundamentalists:

Office of the President
3211 Fourth Street NE Washington DC 20017-1194
Most Reverend Timothy M. Dolan
Archbishop of New York

September 20, 2011

President Barack Obama
The White House
1600 Pennsylvania Ave.
Washington, DC 20500

Dear Mr. President:

I write with a growing sense of urgency about recent actions taken by your Administration that both escalate the threat to marriage and imperil the religious freedom of those who promote and defend marriage. This past spring the Justice Department announced that it would no longer defend the Defense of Marriage Act (DOMA) in court, a decision strongly opposed by the Catholic Bishops of the United States and many others. Now the Justice Department has shifted from not defending DOMA—which is problem enough, given the duty of the executive branch to enforce even laws it disfavors—to actively attacking DOMA‟s constitutionality. My predecessor, Cardinal Francis George, OMI, and I have expressed to you in the past our strong disappointment about the direction your Administration has been moving regarding DOMA. Unfortunately the only response to date has been the intensification of efforts to undermine DOMA and the institution of marriage.

The Justice Department‟s move, in addition to other troubling federal decisions occurring recently, prompts me yet again to register my grave concerns. The content of this letter reflects the strong sentiment expressed at a recent meeting by more than thirty of my brother Bishops who serve on the Administrative Committee of our episcopal conference. I know they are joined by hundreds of additional Catholic bishops throughout our nation. My observations are offered in the spirit of respectful, but frank dialogue.

The Catholic Bishops stand ready to affirm every positive measure taken by you and your Administration to strengthen marriage and the family. We cannot be silent, however, when federal steps harmful to marriage, the laws defending it, and religious freedom continue apace. Attached you will find an analysis prepared by my staff detailing the various executive activities of late that warrant our increasing apprehension.

Mr. President, your Administration‟s actions against DOMA and the values it stands for contrast sharply with your excellent Mother‟s Day and Father‟s Day proclamations issued earlier this year, which are also referenced in the attached analysis. In these perceptive and heartening statements, you correctly emphasize the critical role played by both a mom and a dad in a child‟s life, and you rightly call upon society to do all it can to uphold both mothers and father.

I know that you treasure the importance that you and the First Lady, separately and as a couple, share in the lives of your children. The Mother‟s Day and Father‟s Day proclamations display a welcome conviction on your part that neither a mom nor a dad is expendable. I believe therefore that you would agree that every child has the right to be loved by both a mother and a father. [See the USCCB Staff Analysis of Recent Federal Threats to Marriage April-August 2011 after the break]

Anonymous said...

The institution of marriage is built on this truth, which goes to the core of what the Catholic Bishops of the United States, and the millions of citizens who stand with us on this issue, want for all children and for the common good of society. That is why it is particularly upsetting, Mr. President, when your Administration, through the various court documents, pronouncements and policies identified in the attached analysis, attributes to those who support DOMA a motivation rooted in prejudice and bias. It is especially wrong and unfair to equate opposition to redefining marriage with either intentional or willfully ignorant racial discrimination, as your Administration insists on doing.

We as Bishops of the Catholic Church recognize the immeasurable personal dignity and equal worth of all individuals, including those with same-sex attraction, and we reject all hatred and unjust treatment against any person. Our profound regard for marriage as the complementary and fruitful union of a man and a woman does not negate our concern for the well-being of all people but reinforces it. While all persons merit our full respect, no other relationships provide for the common good what marriage between husband and wife provides. The law should reflect this reality.

Mr. President, I respectfully urge you to push the reset button on your Administration‟s approach to DOMA. Our federal government should not be presuming ill intent or moral blindness on the part of the overwhelming majority of its citizens, millions of whom have gone to the polls to directly support DOMAs in their states and have thereby endorsed marriage as the union of man and woman. Nor should a policy disagreement over the meaning of marriage be treated by federal officials as a federal offense—but this will happen if the Justice Department‟s latest constitutional theory prevails in court. The Administration‟s failure to change course on this matter will, as the attached analysis indicates, precipitate a national conflict between Church and State of enormous proportions and to the detriment of both institutions.

Thus, on behalf of my brother Bishops, I urge yet again that your Administration end its campaign against DOMA, the institution of marriage it protects, and religious freedom. Please know that I am always ready to discuss with you the concerns raised here and to address any questions that you may have. I am convinced that the door to a dialogue that is strong enough to endure even serious and fundamental disagreements can and must remain open, and I believe that you desire the same. Also please know that you, your family, and your Administration continue to be in my prayers.

Faithfully in Christ,

Most Reverend Timothy M. Dolan, Archbishop of New York & President of the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops

Mrs. P

Withywindle said...

Recollecting that Biblical Literalism is not absence of thought, but a well-thought-out hermeneutical tradition; responding (aside from its claim to Truth) 1) to the disintegration of interpretive consensus once the claims of tradition are removed; and 2) to some questionable Papal/Catholic claims to authority based not least on allegorical readings of Scripture (on this rock I will build like Donald Trump, etc.). All this predating the challenge of Science.

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